Thank you for this. My response has been coloured hugely by emotion. But when I read your much more analytical approach, it coheres my thoughts, -It gives my emotions clothes!
Thanks Tim, the questions and answers make it much more clear. It was eye opening to read the part out of Beth’s book, perhaps that’s where the team is at. Hopefully an answer to help everyone will come very soon.
Great read Tim. As you said the social contract was already damaged but completely severed with Vivs departure. I said at the time that I thought it highlighted a poor strategic position for Arsenal and that’s why I don’t think it’s just Jonas that is the issue. The issue is in the framework above him as well. Even if we get a new manager I don’t think things will change until there is an overhaul in the strategic and medical teams.
Always so insightful and measured Tim! I think Jonas needs to go now, regardless of what happens with Chelsea, the team needs to be reenergised and he's clearly lost them. Always found the "Jonas Out" conversation a little frustrating because, like you touch on, a lot of people have filled a void of information around certain player exits/performances with speculation around his character and dynamics with players. I also always found conversation around his touchline behaviour a bit infantalising to the women's game, given that kind of thing would simply be seen as "passion" in the men's game. Nice to see you always cut through that kind of thing. I think the passage from Beth's book is illustrative. Sad to see it end in a likely toxic way, but it's time to go.
Thank you for writing this, Tim. This was a very good read. Being a fan can be emotional, in fact it tends to be wholly emotional for me, but this was helpful in considering matters more logically. I had noticed and been worried about the poor press. I am also not fond of managers talking about players being tired or exhausted. I think it can offer the player an excuse and make them feel more tired than they actually are (although Emily Fox does need a rest!)
As a P.S to the Beth book extract, I remember once hearing Tony Cascarino (wait, hear me out!) talking about why players with no confidence can look like "not trying". He said when you've lost the belief you lose the ability to think you and your team can affect a game positively. So you stop making supporting runs, make basic 5 yard passes, and don't try anything decisive because you're hamstrung by your state of mind. When you're in a fight you don't think you can win, you stop throwing (figurative) punches because you think "what's the point?"
any insights on lottes slow start to the season, especially compared to the end of last season? also any insight into the lack of kuhls minutes, especially after playing a lot and playing well in pre season? thank you as always
Coming from supporting the men's team, interesting see how the treatment of individual players and fan support for them is a far more important issue in view of a manager. Always been a case for me about what progress a manager makes after 3 seasons, either in building or rebuilding a team. It's what Kopp has done recently and Fergie did so well and Wenger did up to 2004.
Thus for me, sadly, I think given Eidevall hasn't sorted out the Low / mid block issue is probably why his time is coming to an end.
I do think it's completely heartbreaking that we lost Viv through a breakdown of relationship and not a fit for the system, given the system has continued to fail and will likely be overhauled
Feels like the implications of tomorrow’s match against Chelsea will be weightier than usual. Even if Jonas gets sacked, who’s the person to take his place and inspire this current squad to the greatness they should be able to achieve based on their player profiles (at least on paper)?
Further thought on the question about whether a manager has comeback from such a poor position, how about Gareth Taylor at Man City 4 seasons ago after he lost 4 key players in the summer and then his first two games including to us 5-0? Still seems to be a lot of dislike for him amongst the fans but he's still there and nearly won the title.
Other than that the only Arsenal person coming back from is Xhaka.
Your measured opinion does help to temper high emotion we fans feel when managers get to be the topic of conversation. We don't always get to know "both sides of the story" and your insight helps in that respect too.
This is a good read, cathartic for sure.
Thank you for this. My response has been coloured hugely by emotion. But when I read your much more analytical approach, it coheres my thoughts, -It gives my emotions clothes!
Thanks Tim, the questions and answers make it much more clear. It was eye opening to read the part out of Beth’s book, perhaps that’s where the team is at. Hopefully an answer to help everyone will come very soon.
Great read Tim. As you said the social contract was already damaged but completely severed with Vivs departure. I said at the time that I thought it highlighted a poor strategic position for Arsenal and that’s why I don’t think it’s just Jonas that is the issue. The issue is in the framework above him as well. Even if we get a new manager I don’t think things will change until there is an overhaul in the strategic and medical teams.
Always so insightful and measured Tim! I think Jonas needs to go now, regardless of what happens with Chelsea, the team needs to be reenergised and he's clearly lost them. Always found the "Jonas Out" conversation a little frustrating because, like you touch on, a lot of people have filled a void of information around certain player exits/performances with speculation around his character and dynamics with players. I also always found conversation around his touchline behaviour a bit infantalising to the women's game, given that kind of thing would simply be seen as "passion" in the men's game. Nice to see you always cut through that kind of thing. I think the passage from Beth's book is illustrative. Sad to see it end in a likely toxic way, but it's time to go.
Good therapy. Thank you Tim.
Thank you for writing this, Tim. This was a very good read. Being a fan can be emotional, in fact it tends to be wholly emotional for me, but this was helpful in considering matters more logically. I had noticed and been worried about the poor press. I am also not fond of managers talking about players being tired or exhausted. I think it can offer the player an excuse and make them feel more tired than they actually are (although Emily Fox does need a rest!)
As a P.S to the Beth book extract, I remember once hearing Tony Cascarino (wait, hear me out!) talking about why players with no confidence can look like "not trying". He said when you've lost the belief you lose the ability to think you and your team can affect a game positively. So you stop making supporting runs, make basic 5 yard passes, and don't try anything decisive because you're hamstrung by your state of mind. When you're in a fight you don't think you can win, you stop throwing (figurative) punches because you think "what's the point?"
hi Tim,
any insights on lottes slow start to the season, especially compared to the end of last season? also any insight into the lack of kuhls minutes, especially after playing a lot and playing well in pre season? thank you as always
Great questions and great responses during unfamiliar times.
Coming from supporting the men's team, interesting see how the treatment of individual players and fan support for them is a far more important issue in view of a manager. Always been a case for me about what progress a manager makes after 3 seasons, either in building or rebuilding a team. It's what Kopp has done recently and Fergie did so well and Wenger did up to 2004.
Thus for me, sadly, I think given Eidevall hasn't sorted out the Low / mid block issue is probably why his time is coming to an end.
I do think it's completely heartbreaking that we lost Viv through a breakdown of relationship and not a fit for the system, given the system has continued to fail and will likely be overhauled
Feels like the implications of tomorrow’s match against Chelsea will be weightier than usual. Even if Jonas gets sacked, who’s the person to take his place and inspire this current squad to the greatness they should be able to achieve based on their player profiles (at least on paper)?
Further thought on the question about whether a manager has comeback from such a poor position, how about Gareth Taylor at Man City 4 seasons ago after he lost 4 key players in the summer and then his first two games including to us 5-0? Still seems to be a lot of dislike for him amongst the fans but he's still there and nearly won the title.
Other than that the only Arsenal person coming back from is Xhaka.
Your measured opinion does help to temper high emotion we fans feel when managers get to be the topic of conversation. We don't always get to know "both sides of the story" and your insight helps in that respect too.